- Approved ~ Lord Løki
My Questions First:
What is more important about the OT, what the bible says or what you infer about what motivates characters in it?
Is Abraham doing what God says because he has faith in God or fears God punishment(one could infer both)?
Is the inference of fear more likely given the amount of verses about wisdom begins by fearing God?
Does “believing God” in Genesis 15 actually mean having faith in God?
I think it means Abraham thinks God is telling him the truth. God is not lying. Why? Later in Genesis, Abraham has little faith in God as he interrogates Him about punishing any righteous that might exist in Sodom and Gomorrah. If Abraham had faith in God, there would be no need to second guess HIS decision making abilities about punishing the city.
Do you think Abraham’s lack of faith is fueling his desire for God not to punish righteous people?
Christianity has it all wrong.
Clearly the way God wants the “relationship” to work is the following. Fear God, why? Because if you do not, then you will not do what he wants, and if you do not do what he wants, bad things happen to you. Clearly it says good things happen if you do what he wants. But as Job shows, even when things go bad, you should still do what God wants because it could get worse.
How does Christianity get it wrong? You have to have “faith”. Where in 500k words of the OT does God say you have to have “faith”? Not one time does someone having faith produce a single benefit in the OT. It is DOING that produces benefits. Doing what? What God commands.
To imagine that “faith” is what God wants because of a single verse where Abraham believed God, is like believing Romeo and Juliet is a book about cutlery because there is a sentence with the word knife.
You do not get something for nothing in the OT.
If you fully obey the Lord your God and carefully follow all his commands I give you today, the Lord your God will set you high above all the nations on earth.
Walk in obedience to all that the Lord your God has commanded you, so that you may live and prosper and prolong your days in the land that you will possess.
Whoever heeds discipline shows the way to life, but whoever ignores correction leads others astray.
Observe what the Lord your God requires: Walk in obedience to him, and keep his decrees and commands, his laws and regulations, as written in the Law of Moses. Do this so that you may prosper in all you do and wherever you go.
1 Kings 2:3
Keep this Book of the Law always on your lips; meditate on it day and night, so that you may be careful to do everything written in it. Then you will be prosperous and successful.
“If you do not listen, and if you do not resolve to honor my name,” says the Lord Almighty, “I will send a curse on you, and I will curse your blessings. Yes, I have already cursed them, because you have not resolved to honor me.”
Blessed are all who fear the Lord, who walk in obedience to him.
In the story we find the people of Nineveh avoiding punishment by not doing evil.
10 When God saw what they did and how they turned from their evil ways, he relented and did not bring on them the destruction he had threatened. Jonah 3
And the most important verse about obedience is when God says
he rewarded Abraham:
“4 I will make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and will give them all these lands, and through your offspring[a] all nations on earth will be blessed,[b] 5 because Abraham obeyed me and did everything I required of him, keeping my commands, my decrees and my instructions.” 6 So Isaac stayed in Gerar.”
You have to do what God tells you or else bad things happen. You have to fear Him, because it says so.
“And to man He said, ‘Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom;
And to depart from evil is understanding.’”
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom;
A good understanding have all those who do His commandments;
His praise endures forever.
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom,
And the knowledge of the Holy One is understanding.
The fear of the Lord is the instruction for wisdom,
And before honor comes humility.
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge;
Fools despise wisdom and instruction.
The fear of the Lord prolongs life,
But the years of the wicked will be shortened.
The fear of the Lord is a fountain of life,
That one may avoid the snares of death.
The fear of the Lord leads to life,
So that one may sleep satisfied, untouched by evil.
And He will be the stability of your times,
A wealth of salvation, wisdom and knowledge;
The fear of the Lord is his treasure.
In the fear of the Lord there is strong confidence,
And his children will have refuge.
Better is a little with the fear of the Lord
Than great treasure and turmoil with it.
Then you will discern the fear of the Lord
And discover the knowledge of God.
Praise the Lord!
How blessed is the man who fears the Lord,
Who greatly delights in His commandments.
A Song of Ascents.
How blessed is everyone who fears the Lord,
Who walks in His ways.
Behold, for thus shall the man be blessed
Who fears the Lord.
“The fear of the Lord is to hate evil;
Pride and arrogance and the evil way
And the perverted mouth, I hate.
Moses said to the people, “Do not be afraid; for God has come in order to test you, and in order that the fear of Him may remain with you, so that you may not sin.”
The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever;
The judgments of the Lord are true; they are righteous altogether.
“Is not your fear of God your confidence,
And the integrity of your ways your hope?
He who walks in his uprightness fears the Lord,
But he who is devious in his ways despises Him.
Do not let your heart envy sinners,
But live in the fear of the Lord always.
Let all the earth fear the Lord;
Let all the inhabitants of the world stand in awe of Him.
You shall eat in the presence of the Lord your God, at the place where He chooses to establish His name, the tithe of your grain, your new wine, your oil, and the firstborn of your herd and your flock, so that you may learn to fear the Lord your God always.
Come, you children, listen to me;
I will teach you the fear of the Lord.
Then a clear warning to kill anyone who preaches rebellion against his commands, even if they produce miracles.
4 It is the Lord your God you must follow, and him you must revere. Keep his commands and obey him; serve him and hold fast to him. 5 That prophet or dreamer must be put to death for inciting rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt and redeemed you from the land of slavery. That prophet or dreamer tried to turn you from the way the Lord your God commanded you to follow. You must purge the evil from among you. Deuteronomy 13